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Talk me down off the ledge


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OK. So you've seen me here before, asking my strange questions.

 

Storyist is wonderful to me on the superficial level. I mean it IS wonderful. I know this. We can do lots of amazing helpful things with Storyist. But whenever I try to do those things...I end up in a maze of frustration. Cause it never works the way I think it's going to and I feel like I'm the only one. I refer to the manual. I look at the support pages here. And I can never find the issue I'm looking for. And I am wasting so much time on this.

 

Latest example? I am trying to work with links. I'm trying to link *each* section of my text to a point on the outline so that I can keep track of the entire building of my plot, point by point (and ultimately weed out redundant sections, etc.)

 

At first it worked magically fine.

But there's one plot point that is, randomly it seems, also linked to the previous section.

I do not know how the link "dropped" there, nor can I see exactly where it is, as link points are not indicated in the text.

I've attached screen grabs, which I'll explain...

 

Screen Grab 1:

The plot point "Chapter 2 - the morning after" is linked where it should link. But it doesn't link to that whole section - only the chapter title. Furthermore, the next outline point, "KC thinks" should link a ways down, on page 10, where the next section starts. Instead, it merely links to the first sentence of "Chapter 2".

 

I tried to change this errant link going off intuition...but I can't get it to work.

And it seems I can only link and unlink everything - all the outline to all the text - at once. Is that right?

 

Screen Grab 2:

I looked it up in the manual, and followed the instructions to Edit>Insert>Link ...but the window that pops up with the link points to choose from does not contain the corresponding plot points on my outline. You'll see they correspond with neither the binder nor the outline. When I put the desired text in the search box, I get nothing.

 

If I try the Edit>Link the other way (placing the curser in the outline point, not the text), I get a text box asking where to link it. I type in the corresponding text, but it doesn't seem to do/change a thing.

 

So!

Anybody understand what's going on and how to fix it? Better yet, how did some of you get to understand this so well? Garrh!

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post-951-0-23676000-1311171453_thumb.png

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Update: Now...I tried selecting the entire text I wish to be the "Chapter 2" link. The window came up...and will do nothing. Won't even go away. I can't cancel it. I can't type in the search box...nothing.

 

Yet I can use Storyist as usual - provided I don't mind a box in the middle of the page. What the what?

 

(The screen grab for this won't attach - says it's too big? And I've had to shut Storyist to make the box go away.)

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Hi, Mercedes:

I'm not sure that I quite follow what is happening. It could be a terminology problem. What I see in the screen shots is that you have your manuscript displayed in three different views. On the left is the outline (Project View). In the middle is the text itself, displayed as text. On the right is the text again, displayed as an outline. Is that correct?

 

If it is, you don't need the link menu to link the views. They are already linked, and to "connect" them so that they move in tandem you need only click the small icon on the bottom of the right window, between the + and the gear menu. That will cause the text and the outline to move in synchrony. The Project View remains independent so that you can get to another part of the file.

 

To stop the middle and right windows from moving together, click the middle button again. If the icon looks like two halves of a linked chain, the windows are connected. If it looks like one broken link, they are not.

 

"Plot points" in Storyist usage are located in the PLOT collection and distinguished by light-bulb icons. You can link them to Section Sheets but not to actual sections of the manuscript. The easiest way to do that is to set up the plot points and section sheets first, then go to the plot point you want to link and right-click (Control-click) where it says "Unassigned" under Section Sheet. Pick your desired section from the list and release the mouse button. Note that each plot point can link to only one section at a time.

Hope that helps,

Marguerite

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Hi, Mercedes:

I'm not sure that I quite follow what is happening. It could be a terminology problem. What I see in the screen shots is that you have your manuscript displayed in three different views. On the left is the outline (Project View). In the middle is the text itself, displayed as text. On the right is the text again, displayed as an outline. Is that correct?

• Yes. That's correct.

 

If it is, you don't need the link menu to link the views. They are already linked, and to "connect" them so that they move in tandem you need only click the small icon on the bottom of the right window, between the + and the gear menu. That will cause the text and the outline to move in synchrony. The Project View remains independent so that you can get to another part of the file.

• My issue is that when I click on that small icon, everything links - but not all to the right things. And I seem unable to change the errant links. How do I manually manage these links? The places Storyist automatically places the links are often incorrect.

 

 

 

Thank you Marguerite. Hopefully you can better understand my problem now.

Furthermore, as I do this, I have lost sections of text. Usually I save them, but this last time? Pages just disappeared. I cannot begin to express my frustration.

 

You're right that when I say "plot points" I mean "points on my outline". (I don't dare even try to mess with actual "plot point" sheets!

 

How in the heck are you so good at Storyist?!

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Thank you Marguerite. Hopefully you can better understand my problem now.

Furthermore, as I do this, I have lost sections of text. Usually I save them, but this last time? Pages just disappeared. I cannot begin to express my frustration.

 

You're right that when I say "plot points" I mean "points on my outline". (I don't dare even try to mess with actual "plot point" sheets!

 

How in the heck are you so good at Storyist?!

Well, one thing I notice is that your outline isn't defined properly. Most of your "sections" are actually chapters, and chapters aren't designed to hold lots of text, just a title: they are essentially folders. If you open a new file based on Novel, you will see that Steve has My Manuscript, then CHAPTER 1 with 3 sections and CHAPTER 2 with two more sections. If you compare that outline with yours, you will see that "KC thinks" is the only section. Everything else is a chapter.

 

The sections are what actually hold your text. So I'm guessing that's why you are losing pages.

 

So I'd suggest that you go through your outline and make sure that the chapters are set up as chapters and the sections as sections. For adding new sections or chapters, make sure you have your cursor in the right place, then choose Add to "My Manuscript" (your own manuscript name will appear here) > Section or Add to "My Manuscript" > Chapter from the gear menu. You can also add additional sections or chapters by clicking +, but you need to be sure you are at the right level. If you have selected a chapter, + will add another chapter. If you have a section selected, + will add another section.

 

You can convert a section to a chapter just by clicking in the text and choosing Chapter Title from the style list at the bottom of the window. To convert a chapter to a section seems to be trickier: easiest way is to copy the text, add the new section, paste the text, delete the old section.

 

As to how I got good at Storyist, I've been using it for four years.... You, too, Young Jedi, can achieve this exalted state. :lol:

Best,

M

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Hi again, M.

 

What you say about the chapters (etc) makes a lot of sense. I think this just illustrates well all those little places where Storyist doesn't do what I'm expecting in my head. I have noticed the asymmetry in, for example, my outline - as you point out. But I never fully understood why. It's one of those things that I just shrugged and kept moving forward...I guess this is where it catches up to you.

 

When I make a new chapter, I just start typing, assuming that that first bit is already in a section. When I need a new section, I add one...and on until the next chapter. So what I think you're telling me is that the only thing that should be in "chapter" is the chapter title. Then, before typing the text, I need to go ahead and start a fresh section? THEN continue?

 

I promise I won't ask you to explain it all, and I will certainly go back and read through Steve's intro *again* with a closer eye on this. But I just want to see if I'm on the right track of how I should change the "map" in my head in order to start being on the same page (har har) with Storyist from here out...

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Hi, Mercedes:

Try this (I just tested it, and it works). All text is example text: you substitute your own. Let's assume you're starting with a new file based on Novel, but you will be able to do the same in your own text.

 

1. Type CHAPTER 1: TITLE on a blank page. Hit return.

2. Type your first sentence: "It was a dark and stormy night." The style list at the bottom of the window should read "Section Text."

3. Move your cursor up to the line that says CHAPTER 1: TITLE and select it. Choose Chapter Title from the style list. Storyist turns CHAPTER 1: TITLE into a chapter and creates an untitled section containing your first sentence.

4. Move back to after "night." Hit return.

Type # on a line by itself. Select it. Choose Section Separator from the style list. See that Storyist has added a new section, also called "Untitled Section."

 

Repeat 2 and 4 as needed until you are done with that chapter. Then go back to 1 to start a new chapter. When you have time, go to the Project View and double-click on each "Untitled Section" and give it a new, more descriptive name.

 

Note that it is useful to include the # before you start a new chapter, even though it is not essential. This is so that you can drag a section to a different point in your novel, if you decide that's where it belongs (to break chapters into smaller units, say).

 

So yes, you need to adjust your thinking just a bit to take into account that chapters in Storyist are folders and the sections hold the actual text, but not too much, as you see.

 

The PNG files you uploaded are quite large. Each user has a space limit of 500MB (I think). You can make screen shots smaller by opening them in Preview, choosing Save as ... and JPEG, then fooling around with the quality settings until the size estimate shows up as about 40KB (Preview's save box shows the size underneath the quality slider). Somewhere in your profile settings for the forum there is an option to Manage Attachments, where you can delete images you no longer need (sorry, I never remember exactly where it is, but if you click around your profile you will see the option).

Best,

M

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Hi Mercedeces,

 

I can certainly help. I think that the confusion may be about what a link is. Comments below.

 

I am trying to work with links. I'm trying to link *each* section of my text to a point on the outline so that I can keep track of the entire building of my plot, point by point (and ultimately weed out redundant sections, etc.)

 

At first it worked magically fine.

But there's one plot point that is, randomly it seems, also linked to the previous section.

I do not know how the link "dropped" there, nor can I see exactly where it is, as link points are not indicated in the text.

I've attached screen grabs, which I'll explain...

 

Screen Grab 1:

The plot point "Chapter 2 - the morning after" is linked where it should link. But it doesn't link to that whole section - only the chapter title. Furthermore, the next outline point, "KC thinks" should link a ways down, on page 10, where the next section starts. Instead, it merely links to the first sentence of "Chapter 2".

 

I tried to change this errant link going off intuition...but I can't get it to work.

And it seems I can only link and unlink everything - all the outline to all the text - at once. Is that right?

 

 

Thanks for posting the screenshots. These are very helpful.

 

From the screen grab, it looks like you've selected the first section in Chp 2 ("KC thinks") in the Project view. The Link editor dialog is up, so you chose Edit > Insert > Link. From your description above, it sounds like you expect that dialog to let you change what is displayed in or connected to the outline in the Project view or in the Outline view.

 

If so, that is the source of the confusion. The Link dialog lets you insert text links--the blue underlined text that, like on a web page, take you to another location when clicked.

 

The outline in the Project view is like a table of contents. It is built from the headings and section separators in your text and is not controlled by the Link dialog. Same with the entries in the Outline view.

 

Screen Grab 2:

I looked it up in the manual, and followed the instructions to Edit>Insert>Link ...but the window that pops up with the link points to choose from does not contain the corresponding plot points on my outline. You'll see they correspond with neither the binder nor the outline. When I put the desired text in the search box, I get nothing.

 

The link dialog shows you the items in your project that you can link to in the text. In your screenshot, you've selected Antagonist, which is a character in your project. If you clicked Insert here, blue underlined text "Antagonist" would be inserted in your manuscript at the current insertion point. The other items I see in the dialog are:

 

* The character sheet "Protagonist."

* The Plot sheets "Girl Rebuffs Boy," "Untitled Plot Point 4," "KC wakes to TF in room, "Rising Action," "Denouement," and "Climax" which you can find in the PLOT collection in Project view.

* The Section sheets "Formatting Your Manuscript," and "Start Writing!" which you can find in the SECTION SHEETS collection in the Project view.

 

Selecting any of these would insert blue underlined text with these titles into your manuscript.

 

Hopefully this is a start. Let me know what else is giving you trouble.

 

-Steve

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I still have to say though, sections just disappear without warning when I try to fix these things. I put in a new chapter, label it...only to realize a minute later that the entire original sectin of text is just...poof! Gone.

 

It's scaring the crap out of me, since I've already lost one. I don't like that at all. Nor do I "get" why it's doing that (I have unlinked everything at this point.) But I'm trying to get this right...

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Is the section really gone, or has it just become a "child" of the chapter? Look at the triangle next to the chapter name. If it is pointing to the right, click on it, so that it points down. You will probably see your section there.

 

See the difference between CHAPTER 3 and CHAPTER 4 in the attached screen shot.

Best,

M

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It seems it's really gone. I have searched for words that were in that section, using the search bar, and nothing is found...

 

I am feeling better though about the rest of it, as I think you hit the nail on the head with my outline being out of sync. I have piece by piece gone back and just cut and pasted each individual section into a totally fresh manuscript. Now the it all seems to be behaving as I would expect. I was messing up the format at the very first of each manuscript, which muddled all the organization thereafter. Now I am aware of that mistake.

 

So Steve you were also right - I thought that the links dialogue would/should change what was linked in the text. I also thought the outline was independent and did not necessarily follow the text. I see it does, and that's actually awesome.

 

I think I had just gotten so frustrated I couldn't see straight. It's one of those things which, now that I see it, is so..."duh"! Properly using the links dialogue box is probably a little advanced after today's frustration blowout ;) but I'll get there.

 

Thank you thank you thank you for being so kind and patient and helpful!

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You're welcome, of course. By the way, if you haven't disabled the feature, you may find your now missing section in a backup. Storyist creates them automatically when you start up. Choose File > Backups and you should see a list. Click on the one with today's or yesterday's date (it will say "Automatic backup") and then on the button that says "open a copy." (Note: do not choose Restore from backup, or you will wipe out your hard work).

 

Storyist will open an untitled file containing your manuscript in the state where it was at the time of the backup. You can copy text, save the file, whatever you need to do. If you close without saving, you will lose that copy but not the original backup.

Best,

M

 

P.S. The missing section isn't "KC wakes to TF in room," by any chance? If so, you will find it under PLOT. But it's probably not text but a section sheet or a plot point (or maybe a note), and you may have to click around among the different views to see the text, if you wrote it in the outline or on an index card.

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Hi M - Thanks for that idea (and new trick). Unfortunately the missing text was not the one you mention, and the right one must've fallen just between the last backup it made yesterday, and the one it made today.

 

Although always frustrating, that missing bit isn't so terrible now that I think I'm on the right track to sort the other stuff. At the very least I remember pretty well what was on those pages, since they were a new section.

 

Thanks again!

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Marguerite, Just wanted to thank you for the "tutorial" on view link. I never used Workspaces feature with split view because the Text and Outline windows were always out of sync. I had no idea you could "link" the view. I never noticed the link icon at the bottom of the screen. I'm sure it's in the manual somewhere, but I don't remember seeing it. The really cool part is that now when I click on a Section in Project View, the descriptive text below the Section heading is automatically visible. That's what I had been complaining about (last summer I think), that I had to click on each and every entry on the outline in order to see the descriptive section text.

 

The more I use Storyist, the more I love it. The hints you give in the forum are invaluable -- for example, adding a section separator at the end of a section just prior to a new Chapter. Now I can drag a section anywhere I please without losing it. My sections used to disappear all of the time. Likewise the hint of adding a second manuscript below your current one to collect all of your chopped sections in case you need them again. This has an added benefit, as you said, of retaining the style formatting. It also keeps the extra text out of your total word count for the Real Manuscript.

 

Thanks to you and all of the other Storyist users for taking the time to help us get to know the program. Thanks to you, Steve, for actually caring about the people who use your program and taking the time to make it just the way we want. That's rare.

 

-TR

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The helpful community is one of the good reasons I choose Storyist. "Links" is something that I haven't yet tried using, as the user guide alone wasn't making it very clear (to me). But now I'm enthusiastic to give it a go.

On a more general point to help learning, is there any possibility for a representative 'specimen' manuscript to be shared amongst users which contains good examples of how Storyist could be used to it's fullest capability?

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Hi, DavidH:

Welcome to the forums. Probably the best example of a "fully loaded" Storyist file is the user manual. You can download the .story file by clicking on the link on this page.

 

You can also check the Storyist > Sharing forum, although I think it mostly contains templates.

Best,

Marguerite

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