LOTR blu-ray out today!

[orrenm]

For those people here who loved The Lord of the Rings trilogy as much as I did* and own a blu-ray player, today is the day that the theatrical movies are finally available on blu-ray! Here's a good review of the trilogy and package, from a noted writer for salon.com and other online sources:

http://scottalanmendelson.blogspot.com/201...ngs-motion.html

 

There will probably be the Enhanced Editions out in a year or two (to coincide with some movie anniversary, the release of The Hobbit movie, something). I'll get those too. But I love the original movies so! This should help take some of the sting away from my recent short story getting it's very first rejection letter. Weee!

 

Orren

 

* In fact, I decided to become a writer after reading LOTR as a teen.

[codemer]

For those people here who loved The Lord of the Rings trilogy as much as I did* and own a blu-ray player, today is the day that the theatrical movies are finally available on blu-ray! Here's a good review of the trilogy and package, from a noted writer for salon.com and other online sources:

http://scottalanmendelson.blogspot.com/201...ngs-motion.html

 

There will probably be the Enhanced Editions out in a year or two (to coincide with some movie anniversary, the release of The Hobbit movie, something). I'll get those too. But I love the original movies so! This should help take some of the sting away from my recent short story getting it's very first rejection letter. Weee!

 

Orren

 

* In fact, I decided to become a writer after reading LOTR as a teen.

 

Do the Bluray versions include the extended footage, or are they just the theatrical versions?

 

IF

[Joolissa]

I believe Orren's reference to the Enhanced Editions is the same as the Extended Editions, so I think the current Bluray package is the theatrical versions. I could be wrong though.

 

I've never seen a Bluray all the way through, just what I've glimpsed in stores.

[Steve E]

I hear that the porn industry is resisting Blu-Ray because it shows every blemish and pore. Oddly though, its very success has already spawned at least eight alternative formats: Blu-ray Disc recordable (obviously), Mini Blu-ray Disc, BD9 (cheaper 9GB disks), BD5 (cheaper still), BDXL (a 128GB Blu-Ray Disk), IH-BD (Intra-Hybrid Blu-Ray, with a read-only layer and a write-once layer), AVCHD (for AVC-encoded HD video), and AVCREC (not sold outside Japan).

 

Will Blu-Ray last as long a BetaMax or VHS?

And what's next, I wonder.

 

In living color.

- Thoth

[orrenm]

Oddly though, its very success has already spawned at least eight alternative formats: Blu-ray Disc recordable (obviously), Mini Blu-ray Disc, BD9 (cheaper 9GB disks), BD5 (cheaper still), BDXL (a 128GB Blu-Ray Disk), IH-BD (Intra-Hybrid Blu-Ray, with a read-only layer and a write-once layer), AVCHD (for AVC-encoded HD video), and AVCREC (not sold outside Japan).

 

I've never heard of any format other than BD and BD-R.

 

Will Blu-Ray last as long a BetaMax or VHS?

 

I think so. Since blu-ray and HDTVs are not ubiquitous yet, they will last until both are ubiquitous, and then probably a little longer.

 

And what's next, I wonder.

 

Most likely a download-only format. I think that DVD and Blu-Ray will have a very long life, but they won't be superseded by another removable media. Right now, commercial HD downloads are limited to 720p and don't include the full blu-ray extras—this is mostly due to limitations in broadband connections and the increased server space required for 1080p movies and extras. When these stop being issues, true HD downloads will be viable. And then it will just be a matter of time before they replace DVD/blu-ray. But I don't see that happening for 10+ years.

 

Orren

 

PS—sorry if i wasn't clear about LOTR. The package release Tuesday included:

• The theatrical releases on blu-ray
  
• The extra features from the original theatrical DVDs (on DVD, not blu-ray)
  
• iTunes digital copies of the theatrical movies
  

 

The Extended Editions of the movies are currently only available on DVD. There are plans, but no dates, to release those as well. So far, I've heard that a release might co-incide with the 10th anniversary of the first movie release (2011) or a simultaneous release with The Hobbit movie (2012?). Either way, we loved the theatrical editions as well as the EEs, and bought them on Monday.

[Steve E]

I've never heard of any format other than BD and BD-R.

And now you have. You're welcome. You can Google any of these formats for the details. (IH-BD returns almost five million hits.)

 

I think so. Since blu-ray and HDTVs are not ubiquitous yet, they will last until both are ubiquitous, and then probably a little longer.

Sorry. It was a rhetorical question. There really isn't any evidence yet that Blu-Ray will last as long as VHS. If anything, the lifetimes of formats are shrinking. Blame our fast-paced modern world.

 

Most likely a download-only format. ... But I don't see that happening for 10+ years.

That has been the conventional wisdom since the 1990s. The "problem" with that is less money for the creators of physical medium. Plus the still-ingrained belief that physical medium is more controllable. Still, this could change. In ten years? In one year. No one has a clue.

 

Either way, we loved the theatrical editions [of LOTR] as well as the EEs, and bought them on Monday.

Way to go Orren.

 

Can't wait for the Total Immersion version of LOTR.

We loves our precious.

- Thoth.

[codemer]

Sorry. It was a rhetorical question. There really isn't any evidence yet that Blu-Ray will last as long as VHS. If anything, the lifetimes of formats are shrinking. Blame our fast-paced modern world.

 

I think BluRay wil continue to grow for about 5 more years before it is overtaken by download. HD quality is only one factor. More and more consumers are getting spoiled by devices like the AppleTV that will let you watch any movie in your collection without having to get up, and to date, you cannot rip a BluRay disc. The fracturing of the BluRay format into new incompatible formats is also a good sign of its early demise.

 

IF

[orrenm]

More and more consumers are getting spoiled by devices like the AppleTV

 

Are there any such devices that have achieved even middling levels of sales?

 

Commercially, AppleTV is a failure. To the point that Apple themselves have had to label it a "hobby" so that investors and financial analysts don't think that it plays a vital role in their bottom line or plans for world domination. And from what I understand, none of them have done very well. I don't think consumers in more but dribbles and drabs have really discovered these video boxes in great numbers, and it will be a long, long time before they are a factor. My feeling is that Cable/U-Verse/FIOS boxes will have to build-in these types of features before they become popular, much like they now build in DVR features.

 

BTW, you can "rip" blu-ray discs, even on a Mac:

http://www.pavtube.com/blu-ray-ripper-mac/

http://www.blurayrippermac.com/

http://www.macblurayripperpro.com/

 

Orren

[Steve E]

I think BluRay wil continue to grow for about 5 more years before it is overtaken by download....

Hi Isaac. As always, I respect your opinion, but (and isn't there always a but) I fail to see how you came up with "5 more years". Why five? Are you privy to some special information about Blu-Ray or download tech? I've looked into this and the only thing I can say for sure is that the life of media in the marketplace is shrinking. This is not to say anything ever completely disappears. The Sony Betamax (produced from 1975-2002) is still around in Japan just as vinyl records and players are still used in the US today.

 

Question: While I'm not expecting to see LOTR released in 1978's Discovision format, has anyone heard of a downloadable version in the works? Would any of you buy it?

 

- Thoth.

[Steve E]

...BTW, you can "rip" blu-ray discs, even on a Mac:

...

I may be misunderstanding the law (I'm not a lawyer) but isn't it now a crime to even tell people how to steal copyrighted content?

 

Not accusing anybody of anything.

- Thoth

[Joolissa]

I may be misunderstanding the law (I'm not a lawyer) but isn't it now a crime to even tell people how to steal copyrighted content?

 

Not accusing anybody of anything.

- Thoth

 

Who says what the person wants to rip is copyrighted... if you could burn something to bluray or have a slideshow or movie you made put onto bluray, it wouldn't be illegal to rip it back.. Also, aren't you allowed to rip a copy of the movies you purchase for back up purposes anyway? I'm not sure about that last part, but that's what I've heard.

 

-Juliepuff

(I think the spam bots must be reading what nicknames you give me, cause the spam I've been getting is been addressed to or is from names like "Juliepuff" haha)

[orrenm]

The Sony Betamax (produced from 1975-2002) is still around in Japan just as vinyl records and players are still used in the US today.

 

Actually, betamax is still used for the "dailies" on movies today in which the movie is recorded onto film rather than digital media.

 

Question: While I'm not expecting to see LOTR released in 1978's Discovision format, has anyone heard of a downloadable version in the works? Would any of you buy it?

 

Not just in the works, but for sale today:

http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore...89&s=143441

 

I would never buy a downloadable movie, unless that was the only format it was available.

1) The resolution even of the HD version is lower than a blu-ray (720p vs. 1080p)

2) The audio of even the HD version is lower than even the DVD (compressed vs. uncompressed in blu-ray, worse compression than DVD)

3) Downloads do not come with the extras (commentaries, making of shorts, etc) in all but a few instances

 

I may be misunderstanding the law (I'm not a lawyer) but isn't it now a crime to even tell people how to steal copyrighted content?

 

All the DVD ripper and blu-ray ripper programs are very clear that:

1) Their software are only to be used on non-copyrighted or self-copyrighted material. For example, I can use these programs to take a DVD of my video, and put it on blu-ray, etc. And yes, you can make playable blu-rays in both PCs and using Final Cut Pro. In fact, most of these programs do not ship with the codecs to decode copyrighted movies, etc. You have to download those on your own (and having never done it, I personally wouldn't know how to, or from where).

2) There is currently legal debate on the license stipulations regarding "personal backup" copying. In some cases, judges have ruled for Hollywood (that you can't make a backup of anything) in other cases they have ruled for the defendant (that burning a single copy of something purchased is okay). I'm sure this issue will be appealed and re-appealed and will be "live" for quite a while.

 

Orren

[Steve E]

Who says what the person wants to rip is copyrighted...

Just sayin', Juliepop. Just in case someone's intentions leaned towards the larcenous.

 

I think the spam bots must be reading what nicknames you give me, cause the spam I've been getting is been addressed to or is from names like "Juliepuff" haha

It pays to have a robust spam filter.

- Thoth

[Steve E]

Actually, betamax is still used for the "dailies" on movies today in which the movie is recorded onto film rather than digital media.

I did not know that.

 

Not just in the works, but [downloadable LOTR is] for sale today:...

Again, I did not know that.

 

[but] I would never buy a downloadable movie, unless that was the only format it was available.

1) The resolution even of the HD version is lower than a blu-ray (720p vs. 1080p)

2) The audio of even the HD version is lower than even the DVD (compressed vs. uncompressed in blu-ray, worse compression than DVD)

3) Downloads do not come with the extras (commentaries, making of shorts, etc) in all but a few instances

Oh, that I strongly suspected.

 

All the DVD ripper and blu-ray ripper programs are very clear that:

1) Their software are only to be used on non-copyrighted or self-copyrighted material. ...

...

Well, they'd have to say that, wouldn't they. I still have to wonder if that statement protects them legally.

- Thoth

[orrenm]

Well, they'd have to say that, wouldn't they. I still have to wonder if that statement protects them legally.

 

I guess it depends how good your lawyers are. But we have a long history in this country of giving people all the tools they need to make mischief, and then not holding the toolmakers responsible. The most obvious example are firearms. You can buy anything up to a semi-automatic submachine gun (specifically, the semi-automatic carbine-type Uzi) legally, but of course if you use it to kill people, that's not the manufacturer's fault....

 

Orren

[codemer]

Hi Isaac. As always, I respect your opinion, but (and isn't there always a but) I fail to see how you came up with "5 more years". Why five?]

 

An educated guess based on my reading, observation of the progress of streaming technology and devices.

 

I may be misunderstanding the law (I'm not a lawyer) but isn't it now a crime to even tell people how to steal copyrighted content?

 

There is no theft involved here. Making backups of your legally purchased videos is fair use under US copyright law as upheld by the Supreme Court.

 

IF

[codemer]

I would never buy a downloadable movie, unless that was the only format it was available.

1) The resolution even of the HD version is lower than a blu-ray (720p vs. 1080p)

2) The audio of even the HD version is lower than even the DVD (compressed vs. uncompressed in blu-ray, worse compression than DVD)

3) Downloads do not come with the extras (commentaries, making of shorts, etc) in all but a few instances

 

These limitations are artificial. As downloaded and streaming content becomes more popular, the studios will be forced to offer more content in order to continue to compete.

 

 

All the DVD ripper and blu-ray ripper programs are very clear that:

1) Their software are only to be used on non-copyrighted or self-copyrighted material. For example, I can use these programs to take a DVD of my video, and put it on blu-ray, etc. And yes, you can make playable blu-rays in both PCs and using Final Cut Pro. In fact, most of these programs do not ship with the codecs to decode copyrighted movies, etc. You have to download those on your own (and having never done it, I personally wouldn't know how to, or from where).

2) There is currently legal debate on the license stipulations regarding "personal backup" copying. In some cases, judges have ruled for Hollywood (that you can't make a backup of anything) in other cases they have ruled for the defendant (that burning a single copy of something purchased is okay). I'm sure this issue will be appealed and re-appealed and will be "live" for quite a while.

 

I think the big issue is the DMCA. The DMCA is an end run around fair use. It is perfectly legal for you to create a backup of your media, but it is illegal for you to circumvent copy protection. Case in point: Adobe used ROT13 to encrypt ebooks. Someone figured it out, and Adobe was able to go after them for violating the DMCA (even though they were outside the US and not subject to our laws when selling software outside the US). The software just read ebooks for def users.

 

The authors of these software tools know people are going to use them on commercial media, but they have to put in those disclaimers to protect themselves from prosecution under the DMCA.

 

IF

[Steve E]

I guess it depends how good your lawyers are. But we have a long history in this country of giving people all the tools they need to make mischief, and then not holding the toolmakers responsible. The most obvious example are firearms. You can buy anything up to a semi-automatic submachine gun (specifically, the semi-automatic carbine-type Uzi) legally, but of course if you use it to kill people, that's not the manufacturer's fault....

So guns don't kill people, people who make guns kill people?

I use my semi-automatic carbine-type Uzi to open beer bottles and squish ity-bity bedbugs like any other right-thinking Bronxite.

 

You know, the Orcs in LOTR managed to do a lot of mayhem without any firearms. Perhaps we should hold the manufacturers of siege engines, battle axes, swords and evil magic to account.

(Just staying on topic.)

-Quick Draw McThoth.

[Steve E]

An educated guess based on my reading, observation of the progress of streaming technology and devices.

A five-year prediction is pretty educated. I can't even get the weather five-days in advance with any accuracy.

 

There is no theft involved here. Making backups of your legally purchased videos is fair use under US copyright law as upheld by the Supreme Court.

I don't think the law reads that way. I think it penalizes people who disseminate decryption techniques that could be used to violate copyright, even if no one uses it to do so. I agree, its a bad law. But the laws in this country are written by the rich and powerful these days.

 

If I were rich and powerful would I get laws passed that benefitted myself while wreaking havoc on others?

- Food for thought...er, Thoth.

[Joolissa]

I guess it depends how good your lawyers are. But we have a long history in this country of giving people all the tools they need to make mischief, and then not holding the toolmakers responsible. The most obvious example are firearms. You can buy anything up to a semi-automatic submachine gun (specifically, the semi-automatic carbine-type Uzi) legally, but of course if you use it to kill people, that's not the manufacturer's fault....

 

Orren

I saw a bumper sticker once (and want to buy it if I ever find it for sale) that said "If guns kill people, then pens misspell words."

 

As for Bluray.... Does anyone have an opinion on whether it will run side by side with DVD until some new fangled thing kills them both? Or do you think Bluray will kill DVD before it is killed by the next thing? I know VHS is still around etc. etc., but it's mostly dead, so that's what I mean.

 

- J

[Steve E]

I saw a bumper sticker once (and want to buy it if I ever find it for sale) that said "If guns kill people, then pens misspell words."

Click here.

 

As for Bluray.... Does anyone have an opinion on whether it will run side by side with DVD until some new fangled thing kills them both? Or do you think Bluray will kill DVD before it is killed by the next thing? I know VHS is still around etc. etc., but it's mostly dead, so that's what I mean.

I think you're right about VHS having entered the zombie phase of its existence. I suspect that DVD will be around for a while if only because of the huge collections people have amassed. But DVD will eventually enter it's zombie phase as well, where it will sit around the camp fire and trade old stories with vinyl records. I suspect that the Blu-ray Disc™ will quickly join them, enjoying a much shorter life than the DVD format. But really, who can say.

 

The pen is mightier than a sword, but not in a sword fight.

- Thoth

[orrenm]

So guns don't kill people, people who make guns kill people?

 

My point was not that gun manufacturers kill people. It is that US law protects gun manufacturers from prosecution, the same way it would protect software developers from prosecution if someone managed to modify their software by adding a non-standard plug-in to allow them to defeat copy protection.

 

You know, the Orcs in LOTR managed to do a lot of mayhem without any firearms. Perhaps we should hold the manufacturers of siege engines, battle axes, swords and evil magic to account.

 

If whatever jurisdiction in which they would be tried in Middle Earth were as manufacturer-friendly as the United States, they would be absolutely fine.

 

Orren

[Steve E]

My point was not that gun manufacturers kill people. It is that US law protects gun manufacturers from prosecution, the same way it would protect software developers from prosecution if someone managed to modify their software by adding a non-standard plug-in to allow them to defeat copy protection.

You are changing the metaphor. The software is the gun. That is, would US law protect software manufacturers from prosecution if the software itself (not some non-standard plug-in) allowed people to defeat copy protection by design?

 

If whatever jurisdiction in which they would be tried in Middle Earth were as manufacturer-friendly as the United States, they would be absolutely fine.

You're probably right, now that the elves are gone.

Chicken-s**t elves.

- Thoth

[orrenm]

I saw a bumper sticker once (and want to buy it if I ever find it for sale) that said "If guns kill people, then pens misspell words."

 

But can I fire a pen like a 9mm Baby Eagle?

 

As for Bluray.... Does anyone have an opinion on whether it will run side by side with DVD until some new fangled thing kills them both? Or do you think Bluray will kill DVD before it is killed by the next thing? I know VHS is still around etc. etc., but it's mostly dead, so that's what I mean.

 

I don't think blu-ray will kill DVD. I think that eventually downloadable media will take over all digital media distribution, and other formats will wither. So both blu-ray and DVD will linger until then. But I don't think that's going to happen for a while (a far longer while than Isaac. And there may be false starts. For example, the CD "killed" vinyl...and then records started making a resurgence. More records are made today than in 2000. So it's possible that disc sales may drop for years, but then suddenly pick up for whatever reason, then drop again, etc.

 

But what do I know? I'm just guessing like everyone else.

 

Orren

[orrenm]

You are changing the metaphor. The software is the gun. That is, would US law protect software manufacturers from prosecution if the software itself (not some non-standard plug-in) allowed people to defeat copy protection by design?

 

Don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Much to my mother's dismay.

 

Orren