The Apple Tablet Event?

[Steve E]

This will go nowhere commercially, if it's ever released.

From your mouth to the god's ears*. Unfortunately, MS is such a big player that I feel it would be foolish to count them and their tablet out before it is even released. But here's hoping.

 

- Thoth

 

*"From your mouth to the god's ears." M gets the credit for setting the mood with her "Amen to that!" Hallelujah brothers and sisters.

[orrenm]

I feel it would be foolish to count them and their tablet out before it is even released.

 

The digital journal is not Microsoft's tablet.

 

This is Microsoft's tablet.

 

The digital journal is a Microsoft "proof of concept" originally designed to "out-Kindle" the Kindle, to see what could be done with the book form factor and a stripped down OS to make a "better than" reader (that is the 9/09 version). However, since then, they have been trying to add more sex to the prototype, to see if they could make it commercially viable in a slate-and-iPad world. This device doesn't compete with slates (even their own) and the dual display design is pretty for book readers but the tablet market is, while we authors may not like to face it, majority gamers, and this device will not appeal to them (ever try gaming on a dual monitor system?)

 

My (rather educated) guess is that this device will never actually be released, but we'll see it's technology emerge in other devices.

Remember, companies like MS, Google, etc. make (and publicize) lots of technology demos and proof-of-concept devices that never see the light of day, or are superseded before they get to market and are cannibalized.

 

BTW—I think some of the underlying technology in the journal is great! I just don't believe this will be released as a product, "trusted source" or no.

 

Orren

[Steve E]

The digital journal is not Microsoft's tablet.

Could have fooled me. It sure looks like a tablet. The HP Slate is no more or less Microsoft's tablet than Microsoft's Courier ("digital journal"), actual existence notwithstanding. And we were talking about the Courier.

 

If you want to talk about the HP Slate, or any other Windows based tablet in this thread, please go right ahead. You have a lot to choose from. We'd love to hear your take on them. But TAS brought up the Currier specifically, for comparison to the iPad. How do you feel the HP Slate compares to the iPad?

 

The digital journal is a Microsoft "proof of concept" originally designed to "out-Kindle" the Kindle, to see what could be done with the book form factor and a stripped down OS to make a "better than" reader (that is the 9/09 version). However, since then, they have been trying to add more sex to the prototype, to see if they could make it commercially viable in a slate-and-iPad world.

They may have succeeded.

 

This device doesn't compete with slates (even their own) and the dual display design is pretty for book readers but the tablet market is, while we authors may not like to face it, majority gamers, and this device will not appeal to them (ever try gaming on a dual monitor system?)

Go back and review their video. It seems to compete just fine. Further, the whole e-book thing is barely mentioned. (Curious. Yes?) And since you asked, yes, I have gamed on a dual monitor. A vastly superior experience to gaming on an iPhone/iTouch, especially if the game takes advantage of the fact.

 

My (rather educated) guess is that this device will never actually be released, but we'll see it's technology emerge in other devices.

Remember, companies like MS, Google, etc. make (and publicize) lots of technology demos and proof-of-concept devices that never see the light of day, or are superseded before they get to market and are cannibalized.

My (over-educated and tearfully experienced) mind remembers people who have said exactly the same thing about Apple and the iPad. I would also point out that companies like MS, Google, etc. make (and publicize) lots of technology demos and proof-of-concept devices that DO see the light of day.

 

Nice to see I'm finally not the cynical one in the conversation.

Idealistically yours,

- Thoth

[orrenm]

If you want to talk about the HP Slate, or any other Windows based tablet in this thread, please go right ahead. You have a lot to choose from. We'd love to hear your take on them.

 

I think they're great! They're Windows PCs with touch screens. If you want to use Windows in a "lounge around the house" form factor, I think they are absolutely the ticket. You can use them as a personal Internet machine and if you need to use it as a serious computer, it's a full Windows install.

 

Back in 2000, the bassist of my band worked for a major internet backbone company, and had access to the first "tablet" computers, a touchscreen PC running Windows 2000. It was basically a 7lb laptop with a pen-sensitive screen instead of a flip-monitor. We used it to run Emagic Logic Platinum (Emagic was purchased in 2002 by Apple, they dropped PC support, and Logic Pro is now an Apple product and Mac-only) and record our band rehearsals. Even back then, I appreciated the power of a tablet computer.

 

But TAS brought up the Currier specifically, for comparison to the iPad. How do you feel the HP Slate compares to the iPad?

 

The iPad is a different device. It's not so much a fully functional "desktop OS computer" as it is a consumer electronic device. Literally, an iPod with a bigger screen. For what it is, I think it's wonderful. But what it is, isn't a full Mac OS X laptop without a flip monitor, like a slate is. So if I wanted a full computer, I'd buy a slate. If I wanted an iPhone with a big screen, I'd buy an iPad.

 

Personally, I don't need a slate—I've got a 13" MBP that is the most rocking portable full computer I've ever had, and I prefer the larger screen and Mac OS. But I'd absolutely recommend one to all my Windows-desktop using friends who are looking for a cheap mobile machine, if they're not planning on doing heavy writing or anything that needs a keyboard.

 

I also don't need an iPad for the same reason as above (my 13" MBP is a dream). But because it's so sleek, and because I love my iPhone so much, I'd *like* one—and to be completely blunt and self aware, it's because I've drunk Steve Jobs's Kool Aid and I believe its got a "coolness" factor that the same device from another manufacturer wouldn't have.

 

 

Nice to see I'm finally not the cynical one in the conversation.

 

I'm not being cynical. One of the developers I speak with who works in Redmond had something to do with the project, told me about it in the Summer of 2009, and at the time, said they weren't sure if they were going to scrap it or keep it. However, my contact is not in marketing, or even product design/development, purely a coder who was "borrowed" from another team to fix a problem back in the "digital journal" days. As far as he knew, it was supposed to be an eReader. Has the product "evolved" into the Courier with a definite release, or was this "very reliable source" doing some "approved leaking" so the company could judge what the buzz around it is, and go from there?

 

I don't know, and I've not spoken to my developer friend for months—and that's not his regular gig, anyway. But its something worth thinking about, no?

 

Also, if Microsoft is co-developing the HP Slate, would they want to potentially compete with themselves? (The answer may very well be yes, many analysts believe that the iPad will cannibalize sales of the iPod Touch).

 

I don't think this is being cynical at all. I believe there is much value—positive value—in creating prototypes to test out technologies, even if they don't become products. My friend was really raving about the device. And if the result is an eReader program for Windows slate computers that blows the pants off the iBooks reader app, you can be sure that MS will be recouping their development money, Courier product or no!

 

Off to do my taxes—now you want to hear cynical....

Orren

[Steve E]

Nice synopsis.

 

Your bassist friend was lucky to have access to one of the first models. My first experience with a touchscreen was in the late-1970s when my company (NCSS - it ran the sixth largest privately-owned network in the US at the time) gave some of us IR touchscreens overlaid around the CRT displays of ADDS Regent 200 terminals (running CSS on the network). It threw a nutty if it was facing an open window on a sunny day. Old times but good times.

 

And to think it may have all started with a 1950 science-fiction short-story by Cordwainer Smith (Paul Linebarger), the brilliant "Scanners Live in Vain". In the future (6000 A.D.) humans will file the nail on their right index finger to a point, to use as a writing implement on tablet computers (you read it there first folks).

 

Good luck with the IRS.

Looking for an emory board,

- Thoth.

[thealtruismsociety]

Full Desktop OS's on slate devices will always be a very bad idea, which is why all Tablet PC's of the past an future Have and WILL fail. This is why I'm so excited about the Courier. There is no guarantee it will come to market and I can see being doubtful but one things makes me hopefully and that is Windows Phone 7. That shows me MS can innovate and can bring products to market.

 

As to compete with the Slate, MS sells OS's not hardware. (Well in this case) They win either way. But the Slate is not going to do good for the same reason no tablet has in the 8 years since it was unveiled. Desktop OS's are bad for tablets. Again going back to Windows Phone 7, the one thing they keep drilling into everyones head about this new OS. "A phone is not a computer". This applies to tablets as well and it's what makes courier so excited.

[Steve E]

Back in the late-1980s one of the hot technologies was the military's computer glasses. Basically, the display was in a pair of goggles and you controlled the "glass cockpit" by looking at specific instruments and saying commands. Every pundit at the time seemed to think this would be the new big thing. OMNI (yes, I know there are better sources but this is the one I remember) claimed that in ten years (from 1980-something) all the desktops would disappear and people would be walking down the street in fancy computer goggles. Of course, they were very optimistic about applied immersive virtual reality at the time.

 

The most that came out of computer goggles for civilian use is TV goggles that hook up to your DVD player so you can watch comfortably in bed, or where ever. And immersive VR is still, after more than 30 years (the term predates the first application), just an exciting idea.

 

I mention the goggles because the tablet moves us another step in that direction.

- Thoth.

[orrenm]

Back in the late-1980s one of the hot technologies was the military's computer glasses...immersive VR is still, after more than 30 years (the term predates the first application), just an exciting idea.

 

Well, at least we avoided the Eugenics Wars and World War III.

 

Why bring up the Trek timeline? Because another thing the iPad brings us closer to is the PADD!

 

Part of me wonders if one of the Trekkers working at 1 Infinite Loop suggested the name iPad with that reference in mind...

 

Orren

[thealtruismsociety]

Back in the late-1980s one of the hot technologies was the military's computer glasses. Basically, the display was in a pair of goggles and you controlled the "glass cockpit" by looking at specific instruments and saying commands. Every pundit at the time seemed to think this would be the new big thing. OMNI (yes, I know there are better sources but this is the one I remember) claimed that in ten years (from 1980-something) all the desktops would disappear and people would be walking down the street in fancy computer goggles. Of course, they were very optimistic about applied immersive virtual reality at the time.

 

The most that came out of computer goggles for civilian use is TV goggles that hook up to your DVD player so you can watch comfortably in bed, or where ever. And immersive VR is still, after more than 30 years (the term predates the first application), just an exciting idea.

 

I mention the goggles because the tablet moves us another step in that direction.

- Thoth.

 

I think VR is going to be replaced by augmented reality and the vehicle with be cell phones not goggles.

[Steve E]

Well, at least we avoided the Eugenics Wars and World War III.

We may have avoided Star Trek's Eugenics Wars (1992-1996) but mass genetic record-keeping is still in its infancy. What's going to happen when your job prospects (and some of your civil rights) are determined by what your health insurance company has on file. Oops. That's already happening. Well, at least WWIII is still a ways off (2053-2053).

 

Why bring up the Trek timeline? Because another thing the iPad brings us closer to is the PADD!

Good find. But I think the iPad looks much cooler. Come to think of it, that whole ST:TOS motif looks pretty retro. (ST:TNG looked much cooler but was far too PC for me.)

 

Part of me wonders if one of the Trekkers working at 1 Infinite Loop suggested the name iPad with that reference in mind...

I wouldn't be at all surprised.

 

Ah Star Trek. You give us so much and ask for so little in return.

- Thoth

 

BTW: Memory Alpha has really got to stop running diet ads in the middle of their pages. It kills the mood.

[orrenm]

Come to think of it, that whole ST:TOS motif looks pretty retro. (ST:TNG looked much cooler but was far too PC for me.)

 

Well, "cooler" is all in the mind of the beholder, isn't it? Personally, I think the 2009 Star Trek by J.J. Abrams takes the TOS characters and puts them in the "coolest" environment yet! The bridge is the Apple Store!

 

But seriously, TNG looks, to my eye, even more dated than TOS (miniskirts/beehive hairdos excepted). There is something very classic about the shirt/pants look. And in fact, the multi-colored shirts/dresses are lifted right from the modern US Navy aircraft carrier deck crew uniforms, so they even have a "military" background.

 

The costumes in TNG look exceptionally 80s. The bridge looks like an 80s dentist's office. And the phasers look like dust busters, not firearms. (And the phaser rifles, those few times they use them, look laughable, like toys. At least the one phaser rifle ever used in TOS looked like a real weapon).

 

That's not to say I don't like TNG. We just bought Season 3 on DVD and we record them when they are on. But we own all the TOS TV shows and movies on Blu-Ray, the 2009 JJTrek, but in TNG we only own First Contact, which is the only one of the TNG movies worth anything. (My wife refuses to see Generations, because in her mind, Kirk never died, and she doesn't want to change it. That and the fact that I and everyone else told her that Generations was a crap film...).

 

I've seen maybe 2-3 shows of DS9 ever, and I don't think I've watched a full episode of Voyager. I know I've not seen any Enterprise shows.

 

 

Ah Star Trek. You give us so much and ask for so little in return.

 

Too true!

 

Orren

[Steve E]

Well, "cooler" is all in the mind of the beholder, isn't it? ...

Absolutely. But JLP was still the best Captain. Accept no substitutes.

 

But seriously, TNG looks, to my eye, even more dated than TOS (miniskirts/beehive hairdos excepted). There is something very classic about the shirt/pants look. And in fact, the multi-colored shirts/dresses are lifted right from the modern US Navy aircraft carrier deck crew uniforms, so they even have a "military" background.

The costumes in TNG look exceptionally 80s. The bridge looks like an 80s dentist's office. And the phasers look like dust busters, not firearms. (And the phaser rifles, those few times they use them, look laughable, like toys. At least the one phaser rifle ever used in TOS looked like a real weapon).

You have got to be kidding me. **sigh** I suppose TOS fans and TNG fans are never going to see eye-to-eye on this.

 

I've seen maybe 2-3 shows of DS9 ever, and I don't think I've watched a full episode of Voyager. I know I've not seen any Enterprise shows.

I think both Enterprise and Voyager have their good points but (are you seated?) DS9 is the best series in the Star Trek franchise. Better than TOS. Better than TNG. Better story arcs. Better one-shots. Better characters (except for Spock and Seven). It's better written. Better thought out. Better acted. Yes, they have the advantage of building on all that has come before but they have added the most to the lore (except for Vulcans which DS9 pretty much ignored, except for their "Take Me Out to the Holosuite" baseball episode). Yes, I've had some arguments about this that have threatened to become violent.

 

BTW: At yesterday's 82nd Academy Awards (March 7, 2010), the 2009 Star Trek movie won for best makeup. It is the first film in the entire history of the franchise to win an Academy Award for anything. I guess some people just don't get it.

 

Oh wait. Tablets give you gorilla arms. There. On topic.

- Thoth.

[orrenm]

But JLP was still the best Captain. Accept no substitutes.

 

That's like saying chocolate is the best dessert. Personally, I adore chocolate, I think it is one of God's gifts. But I have friends who simply don't agree. And that's fine.

 

Patrick Stewart is without question one of the best actors to ever have a recurring role in an Star Trek series. Hell, I loved him since I first saw him in Excalibur! And he really inhabited that breed of contemplative yet decisive "philosopher king" style of leader.

 

But Star Trek TOS was "wagon train to the stars," Horatio Hornblower with a phaser. And James T. Kirk was, by his own admission in some episodes, basically a "frontier policeman" more than a diplomat or philosopher. And yet, he was not a stupid man, even as he jumped head first into every danger and protected his officers (not his redshirts, obviously...) at grave risk to himself. He had bravado, but also empathy. He was a completely different kind of captain to Picard (one can assume that in the 80 years between series, starships took on less patrol and more scientific duties, hence the families on board, and counselors, etc). And as far as acting goes, we can argue if The Shat™ is a good actor or not, but I think it is a given that he also "inhabited" the role of Kirk in a way few others could have. So while Picard/Stewart is the best "philosopher king" captain, I think Kirk equally if not more iconic as the "frontier sheriff."

 

 

I suppose TOS fans and TNG fans are never going to see eye-to-eye on this.

 

I'm a fan of both. But as much as I love Stewart, Burton, and Spiner, nothing beats the Holy Trinity of Shatner, Nimoy, and Kelly.

 

DS9 is the best series in the Star Trek franchise.

 

I've heard that from others. The entire series is on our Netflix rental list. Honestly, I'm surprised that DS9 isn't syndicated. Here in LA, you can catch TOS and TNG on almost every night, but DS9, Voyager, or ENT never. I generally like RDM and I know he was showrunner.

 

BTW: At yesterday's 82nd Academy Awards (March 7, 2010), the 2009 Star Trek movie won for best makeup. It is the first film in the entire history of the franchise to win an Academy Award for anything. I guess some people just don't get it.

 

I watched the whole show. Go JJ Trek! I love what he's done with it, and I loved Trek 2009—and yes, the make-up was excellent. I've not seen hurt locker but I was routing for Trek for Sound Editing as well, as that is my world I know the ways in which they really pushed the envelope on sound design and mixing, even more than Avatar. And I thought it was cute that the make-up award was given to the Trek team by a lifelong, self-avowed Trekkie, Ben Stiller, who even named his production company ("The Red Hour") after an episode of TOS.

 

Oh wait. Tablets give you gorilla arms. There. On topic.

 

Apple debuted two iPad adverts during the Academy Awards. Now we *are* back on topic!

 

Orren

[Steve E]

That's like saying chocolate is the best dessert. ...

No, it's like saying Picard is the best captain. I'm entitled to my opinion and anyone who disagrees with me is entitled to be wrong. (And hot apple pie a la mode is the best dessert, although New York cheesecake with raspberry sauce is a close second.)

 

...So while Picard/Stewart is the best "philosopher king" captain, I think Kirk equally if not more iconic as the "frontier sheriff."

Again, not philosopher king, not frontier sheriff, but best captain of a Federation starship.

 

I'm a fan of both. But as much as I love Stewart, Burton, and Spiner, nothing beats the Holy Trinity of Shatner, Nimoy, and Kelly.

Oh, I agree about the Holy Trinity. Kirk would have failed any number of missions without Spock and Bones backing him up. Picard, on the other hand, can stand on his own.

 

...Honestly, I'm surprised that DS9 isn't syndicated....

It is but is currently not aired in the US. Odd that. The rule of thumb is that a series must have 100+ episodes to be syndicated. DS9 has 173. ST:TOS, surprisingly, has only 79. Go figure.

 

If they sharpen the edges and corners, the iPad could be used as an oversized ninja throwing star, with Web access.

It's all about the shurikens.

Still on topic, kinda.

- Thoth

[thealtruismsociety]

Can your flash player do this?

 

http://media.chikuyonok.ru/ambilight/

 

I'm excited about HTML5 honestly.

[Steve E]

Can your flash player do this?

http://media.chikuyonok.ru/ambilight/

I'm excited about HTML5 honestly.

Dartmoor a short film by James Watson.

Lovely.

- Thoth

[thealtruismsociety]

Dartmoor a short film by James Watson.

Lovely.

- Thoth

 

I was talking about what the player was doing, not the video itself. (Which is great.)

[Steve E]

I was talking about what the player was doing, not the video itself. (Which is great.)

I must have taken my stupid pill today.

Just what was the player doing differently than any other player?

Curious,

- Thoth

[thealtruismsociety]

I must have taken my stupid pill today.

Just what was the player doing differently than any other player?

Curious,

- Thoth

 

Look on the left and right edges, it's dynamically reading the colors of the end pixels and updating the ambiant light shining from the player.

[Steve E]

Look on the left and right edges, it's dynamically reading the colors of the end pixels and updating the ambiant light shining from the player.

I watched it again and, you know what, I totally missed that the first time. My attention was on the video itself. Basically, I'm replicating the distracting ambient light that bounces off movie theater screens and onto movie theater walls at the cost of a smaller video display area (to make room for the "walls" in this special effect).

 

Of passing interest but it's not for me or my future iPad. (On topic. On topic.)

Liked the short, though.

- Thoth.

[thealtruismsociety]

I watched it again and, you know what, I totally missed that the first time. My attention was on the video itself. Basically, I'm replicating the distracting ambient light that bounces off movie theater screens and onto movie theater walls at the cost of a smaller video display area (to make room for the "walls" in this special effect).

 

Of passing interest but it's not for me or my future iPad. (On topic. On topic.)

Liked the short, though.

- Thoth.

 

Yeah it's more a showing what one person can do, pretty impressive to me.

[Joolissa]

Since this thread isn't long dead.... I gotta say that after my major disappointment with the iPad (I wanted an actual tablet computer to replace my wacom darn it!) and my adjustment to "okay it's not what I wanted, but it's pretty cool even if it's just an overgrown iphone. Apps will make it cooler" .... I gotta say that I am in love with the video of that digital journal thingy. I am an Apple girl, but... ooohhh that journal video I watched made my poor little artist/writer heart moan with longing... I have a weakness for journals..... I'm sure that it wouldn't be as good and since it's windows it wouldn't play nice with anything else I have... but that thing pretty much looked like everything I want as far as a digital journal/notepad/planner goes for me to take around, read books on, journal on, do art concepts/sketches on....... Let's send the video to apple and say put this out!

[Steve E]

TAS does find some pretty cool videos.

 

.... Let's send the video to apple and say put this out!

I take some consolation in the fact that Apple tends to grow their products. (Look at the iPhone and iPod.) I'm betting that the first release of iPad, in April, will actually have some surprises. (They've already announced iWork for the iPad.) Steve Jobs said that the iPad fills a gap* between the iMac and the iPod Touch. A pity the first generation iPad is closer to the iPod Touch. I expect the second generation iPad to move closer to the iMac and be that tablet computer we're all hoping for. After all, look what they did with the MacBook Air. Is that technologically so far from a tablet computer?

 

The Audacity of MacHope.

- Thoth.

 

*Between any two things there is a gap.

[Joolissa]

Yea..... buying 1st gen stuff gives you the satisfaction of having the latest and greatest, but it'll leave you whining when that new and improved 2nd gen comes out....Having just got an iphone, I'm betting I'll wish I could have waited until the 4th gen comes out.

[orrenm]

Having just got an iphone, I'm betting I'll wish I could have waited until the 4th gen comes out.

 

The flip side of that is if you always wait for the next gen, which will be better, you'll never get anything. I didn't get a 1st Gen iPhone because I wanted 3G and GPS, video and a better camera lens, which I assumed was coming in the 2nd gen. The 2nd gen (iPhone 3G) came with the 3G and GPS, not video or improved camera, but I bought in anyway. The iPhone 3GS (gen 4) has the video, and I think a better lens. But I'm glad I didn't wait—I've loved my iPhone for every day I've owned it.

 

I knew that the iPad was going to be a very big iPod Touch. Honestly, I'd love one too...if it had a front-aimed camera for video chatting. So I'll wait.

 

Orren